Anyone do commission when selling beats?

numerike

Member
ill o.g.
Battle Points: 1
I usualy sell beats outright to MCs but im doing commission with the MC im doing production for, and am confused in this area. The MC is signed with a huge label (not going to disclose), and havent had the chance to speak to them about it. Basically im going to be doing production for most (not all) of the tracks, and have settled on 50-50 on the sales with the MC. How do the sales get dispearsed? Im doing most but not all of the production so how do they calculate what they owe me? and do i need to copyright the beats beforehand?

Thanks.
 

Sober

ILLIEN
ill o.g.
"and have settled on 50-50 on the sales with the MC"

to me this sounds like how many units you guys sell you will split 50 50 down the line. If theres other producers on it maybe they get thier little cut, but if he specifically told you 50 50 on all sales, it sounds like just you and him are earning money, as well as the big label. Which kinda sucks cause if its as big as you say you better pray you guys move units cause you might have to pay all kinda of people like advertisment, the studio time, and all kinda of ish man. In the end you may see figures you might not like, for all the hard work you did. Doing most of an album is hard work man, i hope you get your honest cut man.:study:
 

Guevara

BETTER THAN YESTERDAY
ill o.g.
Battle Points: 34
this sounds a little suspect for such a "huge label" i hate when people do that, u should find out what kinda contract son has, or what kinda money the label is working wit, whats a huge label to u may not be such a huge label to somebody else.
also, wheres it gonna be sold, u need to ask youreself these questions.or this might turn into a bad lerning experience.

Tell em CiTY sent ya!!!
 

Ash Holmz

The Bed-Stuy Fly Guy
ill o.g.
Battle Points: 207
there are a few diffrent aspects that ur gonna half to look at when deciding this.....the first is what percentage of sales does the artist himself get? I dount he get more than 5-6 points on a record.. unless indepent.. if u split that thats 3 points..and the money does not come inlump sum.. If this is not his first album..how many records/scans/ships did he get with his last album?.. if its a big label like u say and the artist has proven record then all good but most producers noadays get up front and commision...i say dont be generous milk evry dollar you can out of the deal and try to get the most monet upfront that u can get... also u two must sign a contract stating the split..no legal contract..no $$$..ur man willljust take off..if ur dealin wit a mid/major or succesful indie .....alway s get a lawyer....hire someone that dont work for the label..... he can make surre u wont get dicked and make sure evrything straight legal wise
 

God

Creator of the Universe
ill o.g.
Dear numerike:

Congratulations on getting into the "big leagues." Unfortunately a lot of people don't get paid due to creative accounting and power struggles.

1. There are two ways you get paid per royalty, one is the writer's share, and the other is the publisher's share. I assume you are in the United States, hence, you are supposedly guaranteed as a songwriter around 7 cents per record for songwriting, if you are credited as a songwriter. This is the "writer's share." If you split with the MC, you get half.

But the big money is where the publishing comes in, and this is where the "points" you speak of, per album, is going to matter.

The following may get confusing, it's the music business, it's supposed to be confusing :)

Let's say the MC gets twelve points per record for his publishing. What is the record company's share of his publishing? Usually they take at least half of a new artist's publishing. So what is the MC's deal with the record company? If the record company takes half of his publishing, then you're down to six points.

Does the artist have management that is also paid in points? What is the manager's take on a sold album in points? Did he broker the deal? Who did?

If you are the producer, who is the 'executive producer' and what is his/her cut per album? I am almost positive that the 'executive producer' though he/she doesn't actually make the songs, will get a cut from your six points. Let's say he/she takes two points (if you're lucky).

You are now down to four points per album for you and the MC (if all the previously stated is correct, and i hope it isn't) then you get two points and the artist gets two points.

But, you won't get a royalty, unless it's stipulated in the contract, for 100% of sales. They'll usually calculate your royalty out of 90% sales due to breakage, promo, and other stuff. Overseas from the USA, if you are from the USA, you get reduced rates, like 85% in Asia. Check the MC's record deal.

2. Also, how much of the publishing, per song, is spent paying for sample clearances? Some samples require 50-75% of the song's royalty in publishing for clearance.

Have you done the math, per song? Sit down, per song, and split up the sample clearances as well. Then add all the results together.

Remember, you legally get royalties in the United States for up to 11 songs (you probably didn't know that), anything over that is not paid (look at the number of songs on most rock albums, which are usually originally written songs, save for the intro and outro, there's only usually 11). Unless your manager/agent creatively made a deal with the label for the number of samples you used and then spread the royalties over a larger number of songs by calculating how much the samples cut into an alleged 11 song royalty (for example if you have 11 songs, but spend half of that on sample clearance, then you theoretically have only can theoretically, if your deal says it, have 5.5 songs that can be paid on royalty, it depends how good your representative cut the deal with the record company to accomodate for this. Look at what your or the MC's record deal says about what is defined as a "song" too.) In this case, you would have to call your record company's Artist Resources Department for specifics to your album and cost of sample clearance per song.

And then you negotiate with whoever clears the samples. That is grueling.

3. Do you have a manager, or are you using the MC's manager. Is he taking a cut from the both of you?

4. Are you actually signed to the label, or is the MC only signed. Is he signed directly to the label, or through a production company? What is the production company's cut of the royalty, or did they get paid up front the money from the label. I bet you they did, and are not paying you up front per track.

NORMALLY, A PRODUCER GETS THE MONEY UP FRONT PER TRACK. THIS IS THE SAFEST AND MOST PROFITABLE WAY TO MAKE MONEY OFF A RECORD COMPANY.

However, I think your situation is one that involves a production company with an executive producer who actually deal with the label and get funding from the label, who are then supposed to subcontract out songs. I bet you that the exec. producer for your deal is not paying you up front, because he knows you are "hungry" to make it, and a good producer, and is spouting rhetoric like "don't worry, you'll be popular and people will eventually know your name as a producer, so they'll be calling you for beats, after this album hits the street." Meanwhile, he pockets the money.

Just a question. Is the MC you're dealing with in a "crew" that is rapping on his album, and do they all have "record deals" coming their way, or are being shopped around??? Watch out for this, because if you have an exec. producer, and he's smart, he will sign each one to a label, or put them in little "groups" so he can sell them better, and each one will give the exec. producer a chance to get A RECORD DEAL AND A BUDGET FOR EACH ONE.

It doesn't matter whether the album is actually released, the exec. producer can hundreds of thousands of dollars, euros, pounds if he gets money for album budgets like that.

Do you REALLY know what your album budget is? How much was given from the record company to the exec. producer for the album budget? I bet you it was a lot.

5. Remember you have to break even for the company to start paying you. What is the promo budget, etc.? Nobody will tell you... good luck.

Usually, when you're starting off, you get massively cheated in the business on money matters. The thing is to stick with it, because it pays well if you know what you're doing. Don't let it discourage you.

Remember, you have to get in through the door, too, but you have to stick up for yourself, be smart about it, talk to a lawyer (make sure he is a good lawyer w/experience, not a weak one, and not the label's or production company's), and be positive.

Sincerely,
God

THIS POST DOES NOT CONSTITUTE LEGAL ADVICE.
 

Guevara

BETTER THAN YESTERDAY
ill o.g.
Battle Points: 34
GOD-DAMN
That hurt just reading that shit, i hope u get all that down Nu, ima print this shit out to keep on file.
He even put the little legal disclaimer on the bottom.
i would ask God to be my manager but im afraid hell take all my money, plus we all saw what he did to Jesus..lol
 

numerike

Member
ill o.g.
Battle Points: 1
Thanks for the enormous post God, all of it was helpful and explained what i needed to know.
 

fatsdowrong

"SNAPPIN' SKULZ"
ill o.g.
yeah im doin a production project withlike three cats right now, all independent.....
i do em like so, 500 up front each beat, and on paper i gets 30 % of all net proceeds. which ensures me if they wanna play i dont half to break out that gats and bats no more.....if they cant do the 5 birds i might work somethin out dependin on how many tracks i gotta do,and if they got that juice, i try not to work with them balla cats that just wanna make some rap ass sheat cuz they got the bread, i dont really care about the money(but dont tell em that) i do this for the respekt and love of my music, and if theres any shows, or promos..... that all gets factored in as gig time, ya feel me.
 

Guevara

BETTER THAN YESTERDAY
ill o.g.
Battle Points: 34
check out the knock out news thread at the top of this section (industry news)
 

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