Quit Giving your beats away!

[tekboi]

Depends on the situation, let's say you give away a beat but end up getting a good placement that'll get you noticed ... would it still be shameful? Hell nah, ... all your big name producers have done this early in their career, it's called paying dues.

on the other hand to many selling beats equates with complimentary income , times are hard and we all need to eat , in that case your argument def makes sense.

There's no right or wrong answer really.

Yea, I hear ya. The point I'm making here is that people doing this are bringing down the dollar value. That's it.


This dude sums it up perfectly.

http://youtu.be/8LHVAYm_-zc


@unorthadox I just want enough make a living doing this. I don't have to be rich or on TV. It's really as simple as that. It's not about me "not selling beats". It's general principle. Producers.... quit selling yourself short. i give away beats on occasion just like most producers, but on the daily basis?



smh

 

[lion-ucs]

You're still beating this?

The general atmosphere here is "just worry about yourself" take a breathe of it.

Ppl have different ways of going about it. Maybe, give beats out without charging but retain full rights to the song and license that song to buyers. Later it might flourish into an album, that could take them to a musical relationship, a group, a label, whatever. Then of course you have hobbyists that get the joy to hear someone sing/rapping, etc. and who knows that might be what will get them serious into it.

*takes a deep breathe* try it, it feels goooooooooddddd.

 

[Relic]

Dont fight, debate, or Ill kill you all..

 

[Sucio]

.....you won't.

 

[Relic]

Will.

 

[thedreampolice]

My dad can beat up your dad!

 

[LouBez]

Um, food for thought...

10 times outta 10 it is the "up and comming" RAPPER who pays for duplication, does the actual distribution, books the shows, pays for the studio time, pays for the local radio play, and all the rest of the work that actually tales your little wav file and turns it into something...

"up and comming" producers nowadays dont do SHIT but sit inside the AC and quantize.

 

[UNORTHODOX]

@unorthadox I just want enough make a living doing this. I don't have to be rich or on TV. It's really as simple as that. It's not about me "not selling beats". It's general principle. Producers.... quit selling yourself short. i give away beats on occasion just like most producers, but on the daily basis?

I gotta say I still feel you should diversify your talents. Be a walmart not a moms and pops.

 

[Sucio]

10 times outta 10 it is the "up and comming" RAPPER who pays for duplication, does the actual distribution, books the shows, pays for the studio time, pays for the local radio play, and all the rest of the work that actually takes your little wav file and turns it into something...

"up and comming" producers nowadays dont do SHIT but sit inside the AC and quantize.

I take offense to that...


I don't quantize at all.....lol...



Plus the only way the MC gets to shine if he does all of that....Producers do their job with producing the track, that's where their work ends.....They won't push the artist if they are not affiliated......producers push their track to artists who pay for the music....the artist takes that track and pushes the track.....that's how it works...

 

[LouBez]

Nah sucio, that aint how it works cause most "up and comming" producers just give their shit away. The only time a producer should be paid is if a label is involved. If your charging locals and its not bringing you in a respectible income...50k ish, then ur just a dick. Why should an emcee pay ANY unproven producer? Think about it for a minute.

Take another minute.

There is no way to know if the investment you make in an "up and comming" producers track will yeild any return what so ever...so if ur an emcee droping a free mixtape for the net and street why would you pay somebody for a track if they command no audience?

The guys down here who are on deck to make some actual headway in the game dont buy beats for their projects...We just droped this new guy Nephew's tape, hes the face of Ross's Maybach Latino venture, anyway we got free ones from Cool and Dre, DJ Smallz, The Diaz Brothers ( Pitbulls guys), and someone else im leaving out. The point is with these guys willing to work on the arm for an up and comming rappers tape, WHY the hell would a SERIOUS artist pay for a beat straight out the bedroom?

If a rapper is paying a round the way producer its because the rapper sucks cause round the way producers do not charge cats whos talent they actually believe would take em somewhere.

I dont mean to offened brovas, but i've seen a few sides of this business of hip hop man and some of ya'll just think ohhh I got pro tools and reason its time to get PAID! and thats soooooo wrong. This shit takes YEARS.

 

[UNORTHODOX]

@Lou you're talking about a brand focused model. I know thats where everything is headed. It was "here and there" till recently

 

[thedreampolice]

The only time a producer should be paid is if a label is involved. If your charging locals and its not bringing you in a respectible income...50k ish, then ur just a dick. Why should an emcee pay ANY unproven producer? Think about it for a minute.

Totally disagree, a producer should be paid for there work most of the time. If the artist is on a label or not that is not the producers problem. He runs a music production company. He runs a business, why should a producer work for free? Most of my paying clients are not signed. Now some kid in moms basement with no clue is a different conversation. Tell you what I am going to get someone to come over and fix my drywall but since there is not contractor they should work for free right? Think about that for a minute.

 

[tekboi]

Why should an emcee pay ANY unproven producer? Think about it for a minute.

Take another minute.

There is no way to know if the investment you make in an "up and comming" producers track will yeild any return what so ever...so if ur an emcee droping a free mixtape for the net and street why would you pay somebody for a track if they command no audience?

If a rapper is paying a round the way producer its because the rapper sucks cause round the way producers do not charge cats whos talent they actually believe would take em somewhere.

This shit takes YEARS.

Sorry, but your logic sucks. DreamPolice is right on this one.

With your mentality, no new producer would ever make it because everybody would just keep buying from the "big dogs".

A producers job is to do just that... produce. It's up to the rapper to take that product and make it a hit. It's not the producers fault if the rapper sucks balls and nobody wants to buy his shit.

Why pay up & coming producers? well, guess what? it takes more money to produce. It takes hardware, software, and talent. Your logic is totally backwards. Why would I invest my time & creativity into a rapper who probably won't make it in the industry without some kind of compensation?

You're not "investing" in the producer. The producer is investing in YOU. Especially when they give away tracks to an artist. It doesn't matter how hot the rapper is either. That doesn't mean he will get signed or go anywhere. So WE are the ones investing with cheap/free beats.

Rappers might do more ground work than producers, but quite frankly, it takes a whole lot more skill to produce good music than it does to talk in front of a mic. Rappers are a dime a dozen. Producers.... there are alot of them, but not many good ones. That's why producers make money up front and rappers have to make a name for themselves before seeing any money.

It really sounds like you just don't want to pay for beats because you're broke. And you're using your backwards logic as an excuse. And that's the reason why MOST producers charge, so broke ass lame rappers don't suck us dry. We have to get something out of the deal since we know you won't make it anywhere with your career.

 

[tekboi]

also,

this reinforces the point I made in the OP. Thirsty ass producers have de-valued the work that goes into production. Look at the lack of respect, see my point now?

 

[Ozmosis]

First off Tokboi I do agree with you that producers should try to paid you make some good points, but at the same time you got a lot of issues twisted.

A producers job is to do just that... produce. It's up to the rapper to take that product and make it a hit. It's not the producers fault if the rapper sucks balls and nobody wants to buy his shit.

I know we're in the day and age of email the beat to the rapper and the two of you never meet but, Its the producers and rappers responsibility to make a hit, its not just on one person. its a collaborative effort real producing is making a hit song not just making a hot beat. I dont want to start the argument of producer vs. beatmaker but thats what it comes down to.

Rappers might do more ground work than producers, but quite frankly, it takes a whole lot more skill to produce good music than it does to talk in front of a mic. Rappers are a dime a dozen. Producers.... there are alot of them, but not many good ones. That's why producers make money up front and rappers have to make a name for themselves before seeing any money.

I dont see how you can say it takes more skill to make a beat then rap, both need talent and just as much practice you either got or you dont. Everyone is trying to make a name for themselves. Know one has it easier or harder. IMO

 

[2GooD Productions]

A producers job is to do just that... produce. It's up to the rapper to take that product and make it a hit. It's not the producers fault if the rapper sucks balls and nobody wants to buy his shit.

I disagree with this statement, its a producers job to make the emcee sound as good as he possibly can.
Its a producers job to take a concept or idea and make it bloom into a full fledged track.
A beatmakers job is to make beats, a producer produces songs.

If a beatmaker wants to give his beats away for free its up to him, sometimes in todays saturated market, the only way a decent beatmaker can get heard is by giving beats away and building a little buzz.
A producer should be paid for producing tracks, but if an unknown producer can get a well known artist onto one of his tracks for free then the producer still wins and gets the publicity from the established artists fanbase. Its a fine balance, and beats are a commodity that can be traded as well as sold, its just a matter of weighing up the pros and cons, to decide whether what can be gained from a trade is as valuable as the beat. Music is art, cashflow is business. If an artist wants to be heard and isnt interested in money then whats to stop the ARTIST giving away their art for free?

I dont see how you can say it takes more skill to make a beat then rap, both need talent and just as much practice you either got or you dont. Everyone is trying to make a name for themselves. Know one has it easier or harder. IMO

Exactly, thats why when royalties are split it goes 50% music/ 50% lyrics.

 

[tekboi]

If the artist is well known, obviously producers will work for free because of the exposure. But in most cases, it's people (like the guys a couple of post above) who are nobody's but feel they are entitled to beats for some reason.

Yes, rappers need beatmakers/producers and vice versa. But, honestly we are the ones who are taking the gamble and investing. We are the ones who rent property for studios. We are the ones who shell out thousands of dollars for equipment and software. We are the ones who have the talent. Anybody can talk in front of a mic. Everybody cannot produce good music.

I don't mean to turn this into a rapper vs producer thread. But, with making music, you either HAVE IT or you DON'T HAVE IT. Can't say the same about rapping, especially nowadays because they just let anybody do it.

 

[Sucio]

Nah sucio, that aint how it works cause most "up and comming" producers just give their shit away. The only time a producer should be paid is if a label is involved. If your charging locals and its not bringing you in a respectible income...50k ish, then ur just a dick. Why should an emcee pay ANY unproven producer? Think about it for a minute.

What I make with my 9-5 has nothing to do with my music hustle..I work my 9-5 to ensure my bills are paid...

My music hustle is to invest in my ability to improve my overall sound and to keep up with technology.


So whether or not labels are involved is irrelevant. If an "up and coming" producer makes something worthy of a hit single, why shouldn't he (using he not to be sexist) be compensated for his work? I mean shit.....You put in YOUR TIME and EFFORT to create this music....not including what you purchased in terms of equipment/software to make the music and the ELECTRICITY the person pays for to power up their equipment.... Producers provide a SERVICE using their resources which they pay for......why shouldn't they get paid for those services and possibly create some kind of profit?

Supply and demand ring a bell? Yes..there's a shitload supply of beats...but the DEMAND FOR DOPE SHIT IS HIGH and there isn't a high supply of that......and when there's something that is short in supply but in high demand...it will cost more money...

Isn't that why we do this shit?


By the way..where I live...50K a year doesn't mean financial security...especially if you have a family and own a home.....50K a year isn't that much at all...yes..it is "respectable" depending on your location...

But if you really really wanna get out there and make some noise as an artist/producer, you're going to have to fork over some duckets, my friend....in one way or another....

"spend money to make money"

 

[LouBez]

@thedreampolice...We are not talking about the same thing. If you are a PROFESSIONAL PRODUCER then you are running a business and you should charge. Also if you are a PROFESSIONAL PRODUCER the fact that a gang of kids running reason are giving away tracks on soundclick shouldn't affect your business at all, thats why you're a PRO.

Pro's have project studio's with proper room treatmeant, a business model that works, connections with tastemakers in the scene, thousands and THOUSANDS invested in gear, bills that must be paid in order to keep their studio running.

A glorified hobbyist working out of a bedroom on a set of 5"s with a sub has no business charging a local artist NONE...ur just being a dick. Straight up.

@Tekboi...you are living in a fantasy world brova! Like I said If I can get FREE ONES from Cool and Dre for my artists I aint paying YOU a dime....

Thats how the game REALLY works, sorry guy.

Now, dont get it twisted...Its not that I dont think that producers shouldnt be paid up front, yes PROFESSIONAL PRODUCERS should...You guys making beats and working with local artists need to re examine how you do business if you really want to prosper though...It's 2010 and the entire business model for music has changed from the Big Five all the way down to us. Keep waiting to get paid and you will do just that.

Also remember this, when an artist pays a Dr. Dre or a Rick Rubin they are paying for that Producer's Production Quality....they aint paying for a beat.

Look at yourself in the mirror, can you work with an artist and record the best song he has ever made, can you instruct him on techniques to make him sound even better, can you effectively communicate said techniques without messing with the artist's ego, and would an artist respect you enough to listen? Think about that, cause thats what producers do, any dork nowadays can make a beat.

Beatmakers work for free, they are essentially apprentices in the game. You dont gotta take my word for it though just look at your checking account balance. Thats what separates the pros from the hobbyists. Its just the way it is and if you try to construct an alternate reality you'll be disappointed every time....like the "real hip hop" heads from the east coast still waiting for siagon to drop and bring NY back.

 

[UNORTHODOX]

you either HAVE IT or you DON'T HAVE IT. Can't say the same about rapping, especially nowadays because they just let anybody do it.

So they dont let just anybody make beats? lol ok

Its the same amount of people either way. People are passing off beats to hear their shit turned into a song. Rappers freestyle and do mixtapes to hear themselves. You're trying to justify something that works both ways.

You're running a business and hobbyists are cutting into your sales right? (Not my view, yours)

Then being the business man you are (or should be). Why is selling beats your only thing? Why arent you seperating yourself from the nobody's? Why arent you building your brand to where artists in YOUR city NEED a beat from you?

you can have it or not have it. what matters is what you are willing to do, how hard you are willing to work to GET it. Nothing else matters. Take control.